Hdb 2nd Appointment

[Warrior88 0]

Hi everyone,

I am a buyer.

At the 1st appointment, we agreed on the completion date ( 2nd appointment ) = 30/12/2009

This is the end of 8th week. Got a feeling seller dont wanna release the hse.

Got a call from seller, saying that he had approached HDB to ask for extension until 2/1/2010

3 days delay. He mention that he will pay compensation through HDB. Keep telling me he got the rights to delay this date.

Questions I have, do we have the rights to reject them and what will the unforseen problem I will face if I don't give in ...

Anyone had this experience ? Any comments will be appreciated

[berry_surprise 0]

Hi everyone,

I am a buyer.

At the 1st appointment, we agreed on the completion date ( 2nd appointment ) = 30/12/2009

This is the end of 8th week. Got a feeling seller dont wanna release the hse.

Got a call from seller, saying that he had approached HDB to ask for extension until 2/1/2010

3 days delay. He mention that he will pay compensation through HDB. Keep telling me he got the rights to delay this date.

Questions I have, do we have the rights to reject them and what will the unforseen problem I will face if I don't give in ...

Anyone had this experience ? Any comments will be appreciated

well, basically as buyers, we are so screwed.

Pls take a look of what hdb replied to me.

.......................................................

We refer to your email of 28 Nov 2009 to our CEO, regarding your purchase of the above resale flat.

2 You are right that after resale completion, the flat would belong to the buyer. The buyer has every right to live in the flat after completion. In fact, it is an infringement of the Lease condition if the flat owner does not reside at the flat and let out the entire flat within the minimum occupation period without HDB's approval.

3 You mentioned that you have signed an "agreement" to allow the seller to continue to stay in the flat after completion. Besides the possibility of a lease infringement if the "agreement" is carried into effect, such supplemental agreement amounts to a variation of the Option to Purchase (OTP), which may render the OTP legally void. This is because under the terms of the OTP, the seller must give vacant possession and the buyer must accept possession on completion date and any variation of this term may render the OTP void under the existing law.

4 As such, we would strongly advise you to engage a private solicitor to advise you on your legal position and rights without further delay so that you may complete your intended purchase smoothly without any impediment.

5 If you need any clarification, you may contact our officer, Ms Ng Bee Lin, at 64903642.

Yours sincerely

(Signed)

FONG KIN WAI

HEAD (RESALE OPERATIONS)

ESTATE ADMIN & PROPERTY DEPARTMENT

..................................................

[jtec14 0]

Hi everyone,

I am a buyer.

At the 1st appointment, we agreed on the completion date ( 2nd appointment ) = 30/12/2009

This is the end of 8th week. Got a feeling seller dont wanna release the hse.

Got a call from seller, saying that he had approached HDB to ask for extension until 2/1/2010

3 days delay. He mention that he will pay compensation through HDB. Keep telling me he got the rights to delay this date.

Questions I have, do we have the rights to reject them and what will the unforseen problem I will face if I don't give in ...

Anyone had this experience ? Any comments will be appreciated

There is a deadline for sales transactions to be completed, seems to be max 8 weeks where sellers/buyers have the right to delay the completion till then, after which buyers can charge sellers late completion fees(~10% of purchase price) if it is seller's delay.

Ask your HDB officer in charge, he/she should be able to advise, when $$ issues come in, I guessed sellers will feel the pinch.

[Warrior88 0]

Thanks for all the replies, just call up my lawyer, what jtec14 says is correct. Max = 8wks, other seller must compensate daily charge ( 10% purchase price / 365 ) . Eg, purchase price = 400k, daily charge = 110 ... may allow up to max 21 days.

Lawyer says buyer is at the losing end, if they don't turn up on 2nd appointment, at most lawyer can issue this compensate letter. HDB boh chap :(

[waileong 0]

Hi everyone,

I am a buyer.

At the 1st appointment, we agreed on the completion date ( 2nd appointment ) = 30/12/2009

This is the end of 8th week. Got a feeling seller dont wanna release the hse.

Got a call from seller, saying that he had approached HDB to ask for extension until 2/1/2010

3 days delay. He mention that he will pay compensation through HDB. Keep telling me he got the rights to delay this date.

Questions I have, do we have the rights to reject them and what will the unforseen problem I will face if I don't give in ...

Anyone had this experience ? Any comments will be appreciated

What is your question? The date is fixed by HDB, and if change is requested, both parties + HDB must agree.

Why should you be forced to agree?

Why would you be at losing end if they don't turn up at 2nd appt? You can then sue their pants off.

[berry_surprise 0]

What is your question? The date is fixed by HDB, and if change is requested, both parties + HDB must agree.

Why should you be forced to agree?

Why would you be at losing end if they don't turn up at 2nd appt? You can then sue their pants off.

i wish i could, i even intended to sue for compensation.

these kind of sellers n unscrupulous agents take selling house as a game of masak.

the time wasted and opportunities cost for me to buy another flat will be jeopardize because of these ppl.

i already consulted the legal means, there are simply no ways i can get compensated and/or force the sale to go thru.

this is because buyers are at losing end.

if i were to take this up to the court and let's say i win, i still have to bear some part of legal costs.

[forgotten 1]

After reading the stories from this forum, I realise that it's better to buy a house from a owner who has already bought his new house if you are unwilling to wait beyond the 2nd appointment. If owner sells the house before buying one, he will bound to need some extension of stay to renovate new house and move over to it unless he is willing to rent a house to stay temporily in between.

Edited January 19, 2010 by forgotten

[waileong 0]

i wish i could, i even intended to sue for compensation.

these kind of sellers n unscrupulous agents take selling house as a game of masak.

the time wasted and opportunities cost for me to buy another flat will be jeopardize because of these ppl.

i already consulted the legal means, there are simply no ways i can get compensated and/or force the sale to go thru.

this is because buyers are at losing end.

if i were to take this up to the court and let's say i win, i still have to bear some part of legal costs.

You need a better lawyer. What's the point of signing a contract if you can't rely on it, or if you can't sue for losses if the contract is not carried out? The purpose of a contract is to set out each party's rights and obligations legally, and to allow any disputes to be resolved through the courts, and have redress through the courts any failure to perform the contract.

In any court case, there's no guarantee of winning of course, but if you believe you are in the right and you have suffered losses, then you should sue. If ruled in your favour, then you should get full restoration to your position before the contract.

Edited January 19, 2010 by waileong

[berry_surprise 0]

You need a better lawyer. What's the point of signing a contract if you can't rely on it, or if you can't sue for losses if the contract is not carried out? The purpose of a contract is to set out each party's rights and obligations legally, and to allow any disputes to be resolved through the courts, and have redress through the courts any failure to perform the contract.

In any court case, there's no guarantee of winning of course, but if you believe you are in the right and you have suffered losses, then you should sue. If ruled in your favour, then you should get full restoration to your position before the contract.

pls tell me any super lawyer who u know.

this owner disregard the contract of going for early 1st appt (before she leave for long holiday) and threaten not to sell her house anymore if i were to go for early appt.

this owner still want her 2 mth extension after 2nd appt from me despite disregarding her earlier contract with me.

my partner says nevermind and my incompetent agent can throw one side, everything i have to do and dictate.

since 1 fine day in november, i washed my hands off this.

no eyes to see....so next wk is my 1st appt then i shall see and F every1 if the need arises.

[Warrior88 0]

pls tell me any super lawyer who u know.

this owner disregard the contract of going for early 1st appt (before she leave for long holiday) and threaten not to sell her house anymore if i were to go for early appt.

this owner still want her 2 mth extension after 2nd appt from me despite disregarding her earlier contract with me.

my partner says nevermind and my incompetent agent can throw one side, everything i have to do and dictate.

since 1 fine day in november, i washed my hands off this.

no eyes to see....so next wk is my 1st appt then i shall see and F every1 if the need arises.

1.Keep cool... on the 1st appointment.

2. Do not commit anything about the 2 mth ext, do not argue on this matter too. Just say you have to check if it is legal to do that. Try to keep calm.

3. Buyer lawyer will issue letter to owner for compensation of max 21 days if they don't vacate the hse

4. If you allow the 2 mth ext, you break the HDB rule as renting out the unit. ( don't tell them first )

[berry_surprise 0]

1.Keep cool... on the 1st appointment.

2. Do not commit anything about the 2 mth ext, do not argue on this matter too. Just say you have to check if it is legal to do that. Try to keep calm.

3. Buyer lawyer will issue letter to owner for compensation of max 21 days if they don't vacate the hse

4. If you allow the 2 mth ext, you break the HDB rule as renting out the unit. ( don't tell them first )

I even wrote to HDB CEO on this matter, they also say it is not right to do extension after 2nd appt. So y in the 1st place, the agents do such a thing?

I am just waiting to sign my name on the 1st appt date.

I will be using HDB lawyer and I do have intentions to chase them out, however this is not a very good thing to do.

Do u know while waiting for 1st appt, our HLE expires and we have to reapply for another HLE?

now HDB place a warning on their new website saying...

Important Notes:

* Buyers and Sellers are reminded not to enter into any supplementary agreements/arrangements to allow for the sellers to prolong their stay in the flat.

* After the signing of the transfer documents, the flat is legally under the buyers names and thus the buyers will be held responsible should anything unpleasant arise.

* If sellers require a longer time to vacate the flat, they should discuss with the buyers and inform HDB resale officers to schedule the completion appointment at a later date.

Now i foresee things will get uglier .....

Edited January 21, 2010 by berry_surprise

[forgotten 1]

Berry surprise,

Well the agents do such 'illegal' things and will promise sellers the MOON & STARS because they want to coax sellers to use them as agents. So many agents are earning >20K every month lor.

I hope our sellers won't smash things in the house and create a dirty mess etc. before handing the units over to us. That will be a nightmare.

Good luck to both of us at our first appointments next week! Hope things don't turn ugly at our appointments.

Edited January 21, 2010 by forgotten

[wolflet 1]

Berry surprise,

Well the agents do such 'illegal' things and will promise sellers the MOON & STARS because they want to coax sellers to use them as agents. So many agents are earning >20K every month lor.

I hope our sellers won't smash things in the house and create a dirty mess etc. before handing the units over to us. That will be a nightmare.

Good luck to both of us at our first appointments next week! Hope things don't turn ugly at our appointments.

i'm in the same situation of 6 weeks extended stay. but the sellers are very kindly family and thus, i don't have any issue with them. that day i made arrangements with them to go up and take photos to facilitate my ID shopping. when i leave, the uncle even say "need to see anything, just call. you already bought the flat. dun worry about disturbing us"

[forgotten 1]

i'm in the same situation of 6 weeks extended stay. but the sellers are very kindly family and thus, i don't have any issue with them. that day i made arrangements with them to go up and take photos to facilitate my ID shopping. when i leave, the uncle even say "need to see anything, just call. you already bought the flat. dun worry about disturbing us"

That's so sweet of your seller.

Up till now, I never talk to my seller before. My agent liased with him on behalf of us, and he sent his agent to liase with us on the day we exercised of OTP.

The HDB first appointment will be the first time we get to talk to our seller LOL.

Edited January 22, 2010 by forgotten

[Ah wong 0]

Hi berry surprise,

I was indeed surprise to read about your encounter with your seller and agent, from those previous earlier posts you wrote, thought things had gone well after found your sweet home... , me no better then you, if have read about my post, the agent denied he had given up looking for us a new flat, reason is he cannot find he right unit that we want, wtf, looking at saturday paper, in pasir ris area, more than 50 ad and he said cannot find, and from my 1st appt to 2nd appt, not a single call from him, eventually we had a faceoff in a coffeeshop together with my fren who intro him to me, F him off with a check issue to the company, he wanted me to transfer the comm to his bank account initially, but i wanted an official invoice...

So for your case, i think if you have not sign any agreement with the agent, play with him lah. For the signed agreement for your seller to extend the stay after the 2nd appointment, show him and agent the hdb reply you got and get him to explain why in first place never warn or alert you that it is against hdb rule to extend the stay after the 2nd appointment, since they had make you busy since day 1, do somethings to make them busy back lor...