Water Dripping From False Ceiling

[countblessings 0]

Please help enlighten me on what could be the possible causes of the following trouble:

I live on the 11th floor of a condo. My neighbour living on the floor below me, 10th floor, has water dripping down from the false ceiling of her master bedroom toilet. Water was dripping down from the centre of the toilet, on raining and sunny days. The water could NOT come from other units because:

1) directly on top of her master bedroom toilet is my toilet (the design layout is the same for the 10th and 11th floor)

2) on 2 sides of her toilet, are bedrooms

3) on the third side is the passage to the bedrooms

4) on the fourth side is the outside of the house

So the water has to come from my unit.

To investigate where the water came from:

1) I locked up my master bedroom toilet and did not use the toilet at all for 6 weeks already.

2) I also stopped using the air conditioners for my whole house for 6 weeks already.

After 6 weeks, Water is still dripping from my neighbour's master bedroom toilet false ceiling.

My contractor went to the 10th floor unit to investigate. I suggested that a possible cause is the 10th floor's leaking water heater or leaking air conditioner pipe. My contractor said "No, those 2 things are Not the cause."

My contractor also said he might hack up my master bedroom toilet floor until the water proofing level. My existing air conditioner pipe is laid below the water proofing. He said he would add more water proofing material and raise my air-conditioner pipe to be above the water proofing. He would do the work in my house for free because he was the contractor renovating my house. My house was renovated for just one year ago"

I really do not know what to do?

I am not willing to have my floor hacked up and re-tiled unless the cause is from my house. Anyone has any idea, please enlighten me.

Thanks.

[morganwu 0]

There are lots of concealed piping in condos.

You should ask your MCST to obtain the drawings for the piping first before hacking anything.

Please help enlighten me on what could be the possible causes of the following trouble:

I live on the 11th floor of a condo. My neighbour living on the floor below me, 10th floor, has water dripping down from the false ceiling of her master bedroom toilet. Water was dripping down from the centre of the toilet, on raining and sunny days. The water could NOT come from other units because:

1) directly on top of her master bedroom toilet is my toilet (the design layout is the same for the 10th and 11th floor)

2) on 2 sides of her toilet, are bedrooms

3) on the third side is the passage to the bedrooms

4) on the fourth side is the outside of the house

So the water has to come from my unit.

To investigate where the water came from:

1) I locked up my master bedroom toilet and did not use the toilet at all for 6 weeks already.

2) I also stopped using the air conditioners for my whole house for 6 weeks already.

After 6 weeks, Water is still dripping from my neighbour's master bedroom toilet false ceiling.

My contractor went to the 10th floor unit to investigate. I suggested that a possible cause is the 10th floor's leaking water heater or leaking air conditioner pipe. My contractor said "No, those 2 things are Not the cause."

My contractor also said he might hack up my master bedroom toilet floor until the water proofing level. My existing air conditioner pipe is laid below the water proofing. He said he would add more water proofing material and raise my air-conditioner pipe to be above the water proofing. He would do the work in my house for free because he was the contractor renovating my house. My house was renovated for just one year ago"

I really do not know what to do?

I am not willing to have my floor hacked up and re-tiled unless the cause is from my house. Anyone has any idea, please enlighten me.

Thanks.

[yoongf 11]

Contractor went to level 10 unit to investigate. He shd have opned up the false ceiling to see what kind of leak it is.

The colour of the water, the location of the leak and the intensity of the leak will identify the source of the leak.

Did he describe to u?

If after 6 weeks of non use and is still leaking, likely is the water supply pipe that is leaking.

Most water supply pipe is embedded into the walls.

If that is the case, is better to abondon that strech of leaking pipe and rerun new pipings.

[countblessings 0]

There are lots of concealed piping in condos.

You should ask your MCST to obtain the drawings for the piping first before hacking anything.

Hi Morganwu

Thank you for the advice. Will do that tomorrow.

[countblessings 0]

Contractor went to level 10 unit to investigate. He shd have opned up the false ceiling to see what kind of leak it is.

The colour of the water, the location of the leak and the intensity of the leak will identify the source of the leak.

Did he describe to u?

If after 6 weeks of non use and is still leaking, likely is the water supply pipe that is leaking.

Most water supply pipe is embedded into the walls.

If that is the case, is better to abondon that strech of leaking pipe and rerun new pipings.

Hi Yoongf

Thank you for your advice. You gave me plenty of ideas. Contractor did not describe to me the colour of the water nor the intensity of the leak.

I bought and renovated my unit about one year ago. The condo is about 12 years old. I changed all my water pipes, air-con pipes and electrical wires when I renovated my unit. Although I lived in my present house for one year already, I have used the master toilet shower room only 3 times so far, hardly used the sink, and used the WC at night only. I washed the floor once a fortnight. We use the common toilet nearly all the time.

Yesterday, I went down to level 10 to look at the ceiling of the master toilet and the maid toilet.

Master toilet:

80% of the ceiling was stained, very bad stains, brown and dark brown in colour. There was a tiny hole near the centre of the toilet false ceiling. To my non-professional eyes, I think the stain started many years ago, probably 3 or 5 years ago. I think it is likely that the level 10's water heater leaks or their pipe leaks and thus cause water to drip down the hole from the centre of their false ceiling. When I was there, there was no water dripping down.

Level 10 owner said their ceiling was very awful, needed to change. However, they would not pay a single cent.

My contractor said from the 2 ft square opening he could not see clearly where the water comes from. He needs to take down the false ceiling, at least half of it to acertain the cause of the water leak. Contractor thinks another possible cause is water running down the wire from the roof; if this is the case, it will be management's problem. I forgot to ask contractor what wire he was referring to.

I said I will not allow any hacking up of my house unless I see for myself and am convinced that the water is from my house. During the renovation of my unit one year ago, I closely supervised the work daily, and witnessed that waterproofing for all wet areas were properly done.

Can anyone enlighten me:

1) If my toilet floor waterproofing or my air-con pipe is the cause, who should pay for doing up level 10's false ceiling? ( My contractor will do the water proofing and re-lay the air-con pipe in my master toilet for free.)

2) If the cause is level 10's pipe which leaks, who should pay to change level 10's pipe?

Maid's Toilet:

1) In level 10's maid's toilet, when one enters the toilet, on the left side 2 inch away from the door, the false ceiling joining the outside wall has a semi-circle dark stain. Every original unit will have the maid's sink, pipes, tap and shower head there. However, I have shifted my sink, tap, pipes and shower head to the right wall. My left wall is blank. I am at my wit's end. It could not be caused by rain water coming in from outside because the stain is a nice semi-circle. What could be the cause? Could anyone please help here.

The condo management's contractor said, "Water stains the level 10's false ceiling. Level 10's water cannot run up to stain its own false ceiling. The water must come from upstairs, level 11. Level 11 must re-do the water-proofing."

My contractor suspects that level 10's pipe leaks. If it is correct, who should pay for changing level 10's pipe?

2) Above the WC, there was stain on the ceiling. Another headache! What could be the likely cause, please?

I would be grateful for any help.

Edited April 22, 2012 by countblessings

[yoongf 11]

Under the law....

Inter-floor leaks

If there is an inter-floor leak, you and your neighbour are required to jointly carry

out an investigation to establish the cause of the leak and proceed with the repair

works. You should also both resolve the cost of repair. In cases like this, it is presumed

that the leak has originated from the upper floor unit unless the owner can

prove otherwise. Therefore, the owner of the upper floor unit cannot claim that

the leak has not originated from a defect in his unit. He has to jointly investigate

the cause with his lower-floor neighbour and proceed with any repairs required.

http://www.bca.gov.sg/BMSM/others/strata_living.pdf

U have to bite the bullet and open up the false ceiling.

If determined is from your unit, then bo pian. If source is from level 10 pipe.. (supply water/water heater) , false ceiling repair not yr problem.

Remember to take as much photos as possible.

[countblessings 0]

Hi Yoongf

Thank you for your advice and link. I appreciate your help.

My contractor has agreed to open up the downstairs' false ceiling to investigate this coming Wednesday. To re-do the downstairs' false ceiling for the master toilet and maid toilet the quotation given to downstairs' owner has been reduced from $1200 to $500. Downstairs' owner sms me to pay the $500. I replied, "No." Am I right? (Assuming the cost of re-doing my master toilet floor and maid toilet floor comes up to $6000, can I ask downstairs to pay? I doubt I can ask. My contractor has said he will re-do any necessary work in my unit for free.)

My friend, living in another condo, told me that she has to pay 100% of the cost for changing the pipe in her kitchen (according to Singapore law) which leaks and causes damage to the unit below her unit.

My condo manager said if the downstairs false ceiling is open up and a pipe is found leaking and if that pipe serves my unit, I have to pay 100% to change or repair it. He gave the example of the U pipe linking my floor trap to the straight pipe which serves all units in the same stack. He further explained that if I don't pay, downstairs can do something to stop usage of that pipe and then I can't run water down my floor trap.

Could you please advise me where to read up for info on this matter or where to get advice?

Thank you.