Stairs for semi-d: 2-flight or 3-flight?

[snoozee 97]

53 minutes ago, Jack L said:

Thanks, @snoozee. At what stage should those details be specified? I am currently at schematic design and no plan has been submitted yet.

my aircon plan was done up before plans was submitted to URA. Cos I had to decide between installing normal wall mounted aircon or ducted aircon for my living room. Because I have a mezzanine, I can't do ceiling cassette units since the ceiling will be too high up. In the end I chose ducted aircon as it would make it more seamless rather than have 2 wall mount units jutting out of the wall.

since all the aircon pipes have to be routed all the way from 1st floor to the attic, we had to plan how the pipes (gas and water drain pipes) are to be run. For gas pipes, we designed a "service duct" where the gas pipes all traverse vertically up from 1st storey to the attic and these are later hidden in box ups with brick walls. So in the drawings, there are holes indicated in the floor slabs for this "service duct" so that the workers can adjust the rebars around this hole and put the form work/PVC pipes for this hole before casting the floor slab. The holes are indicated in the drawings so that workers will not miss out. During construction, many things are happening concurrently so it is very easy to miss out small details like this. If this detail is missed out, then the floor slab will have to hacked or cored through which is not ideal.

I think what you need to now is to confirm your layout of your house. Once this is finalised, you can decide on the placements of the light switches, power sockets, network points and aircon positions in the rooms. tap or water outlet points for toilets, kitchens and yards can also be decided at this stage.  the number of lights and how you want the light switches to be controlled (one way or two way switches) must also be done at this stage as well.

the aircon height position on the wall can be decided on the spot when the installation is done. But if you don't want the false ceiling recess to be done, you must remember to cater for the false ceiling drop and install the wall unit lower than the ceiling. Cos the sequence is that the gas pipes and drain pipes for aircon will be done up first before the false ceiling is done to hide all these pipes. if your aircon installer terminate the pipes at too high a position, you will end up with the recess later when false ceiling is done. When I was briefing my aircon installers, I specifically told them I don't want this problem and we took reference from the lowest point in each room to determine where the aircon height will be.

basically once the floor plan layout is finalised, all the ancillary services planning will come in.

[Jack L 0]

1 hour ago, snoozee said:

since all the aircon pipes have to be routed all the way from 1st floor to the attic, we had to plan how the pipes (gas and water drain pipes) are to be run. For gas pipes, we designed a "service duct" where the gas pipes all traverse vertically up from 1st storey to the attic and these are later hidden in box ups with brick walls. So in the drawings, there are holes indicated in the floor slabs for this "service duct" so that the workers can adjust the rebars around this hole and put the form work/PVC pipes for this hole before casting the floor slab. The holes are indicated in the drawings so that workers will not miss out. During construction, many things are happening concurrently so it is very easy to miss out small details like this. If this detail is missed out, then the floor slab will have to hacked or cored through which is not ideal.

Are you using VRF/VRV for the outdoor unit? Thanks for detailed explanation. It helps a lot

[snoozee 97]

5 hours ago, Jack L said:

Are you using VRF/VRV for the outdoor unit? Thanks for detailed explanation. It helps a lot

Nope. Just normal split unit aircon systems for rooms except for master (single unit) and living room (ducted). 

[Jack L 0]

On 9/25/2021 at 4:01 PM, snoozee said:

Nope. Just normal split unit aircon systems for rooms except for master (single unit) and living room (ducted). 

Thanks, snoozee. I was wondering whether to have multiple splits or VRF/VRV system

[snoozee 97]

47 minutes ago, Jack L said:

Thanks, snoozee. I was wondering whether to have multiple splits or VRF/VRV system

I don't think need to go to this extent just for a landed house. one thing you need to take note of is the size of the aircon compressors as well. For domestic systems, the compressors are usually about 800mm to 1m in height whereas compressors for commercial use and VRV/VRF systems can be more than 1m in height. During construction when windows and such are not in, it's easy to bring in big aircon compressors. But if you have a huge aircon compressor, you will have problems when you need to replace it later on if you don't have big enough openings to remove the compressor. If your aircon ledge is located at the back of the house, you will need to hire a huge crane just to reach over from the front to the back to remove the compressor. Depending on the size/capacity of the crane, the cost per hour rental can be more than 1k per hour.

URA regulations state that aircon compressors must be set more than 2m away from the boundary line to reduce noise pollution for your neighbours. So if you want to put the aircon compressors at the side, you will need to create a recess area for this purpose. Else the norm is to put them in the rear (attic) area just beyond the 2m setback. To obtain CSC, you will also need to provide a noise level report on the aircon compressors for NEA as well to get their CSC clearance.

[IceEyez 4]

1 hour ago, snoozee said:

I don't think need to go to this extent just for a landed house. one thing you need to take note of is the size of the aircon compressors as well. For domestic systems, the compressors are usually about 800mm to 1m in height whereas compressors for commercial use and VRV/VRF systems can be more than 1m in height. During construction when windows and such are not in, it's easy to bring in big aircon compressors. But if you have a huge aircon compressor, you will have problems when you need to replace it later on if you don't have big enough openings to remove the compressor. If your aircon ledge is located at the back of the house, you will need to hire a huge crane just to reach over from the front to the back to remove the compressor. Depending on the size/capacity of the crane, the cost per hour rental can be more than 1k per hour.

URA regulations state that aircon compressors must be set more than 2m away from the boundary line to reduce noise pollution for your neighbours. So if you want to put the aircon compressors at the side, you will need to create a recess area for this purpose. Else the norm is to put them in the rear (attic) area just beyond the 2m setback. To obtain CSC, you will also need to provide a noise level report on the aircon compressors for NEA as well to get their CSC clearance.

Hi Snozee,

Just FYI, it is no longer a requirement to provide noise level reports for A/C compressions to NEA for CSC clearance since 2019.

[snoozee 97]

1 hour ago, IceEyez said:

Hi Snozee,

Just FYI, it is no longer a requirement to provide noise level reports for A/C compressions to NEA for CSC clearance since 2019.

yes I am aware, QP can just do a lodegment to NEA. My architect did this for me. It's just whether the QP wants to help the client save the $$$ and bear the responsibility if anything goes wrong.
 

[Jack L 0]

23 hours ago, snoozee said:

I don't think need to go to this extent just for a landed house. one thing you need to take note of is the size of the aircon compressors as well. For domestic systems, the compressors are usually about 800mm to 1m in height whereas compressors for commercial use and VRV/VRF systems can be more than 1m in height. During construction when windows and such are not in, it's easy to bring in big aircon compressors. But if you have a huge aircon compressor, you will have problems when you need to replace it later on if you don't have big enough openings to remove the compressor. If your aircon ledge is located at the back of the house, you will need to hire a huge crane just to reach over from the front to the back to remove the compressor. Depending on the size/capacity of the crane, the cost per hour rental can be more than 1k per hour.

Glad I have asked. This definitely is one of the important factors that need to be taken into consideration. 👍

[Topline 1]

On 9/27/2021 at 11:36 AM, snoozee said:

I don't think need to go to this extent just for a landed house. one thing you need to take note of is the size of the aircon compressors as well. For domestic systems, the compressors are usually about 800mm to 1m in height whereas compressors for commercial use and VRV/VRF systems can be more than 1m in height. During construction when windows and such are not in, it's easy to bring in big aircon compressors. But if you have a huge aircon compressor, you will have problems when you need to replace it later on if you don't have big enough openings to remove the compressor. If your aircon ledge is located at the back of the house, you will need to hire a huge crane just to reach over from the front to the back to remove the compressor. Depending on the size/capacity of the crane, the cost per hour rental can be more than 1k per hour.

URA regulations state that aircon compressors must be set more than 2m away from the boundary line to reduce noise pollution for your neighbours. So if you want to put the aircon compressors at the side, you will need to create a recess area for this purpose. Else the norm is to put them in the rear (attic) area just beyond the 2m setback. To obtain CSC, you will also need to provide a noise level report on the aircon compressors for NEA as well to get their CSC clearance.

Hi Snoozee, just wondering why is it necessary to rent the crane? Can't they carry the compressor up the stairs to the attic?

I dunno how true this is but was told some air con brands are disrupted by supply issues and some market players are suggesting VRV cos there's stock.

But besides the height of the unit, are there downsides to using a VRV? Eg operating costs?

Edited September 30, 2021 by Topline
Typo

[snoozee 97]

9 hours ago, Topline said:

Hi Snoozee, just wondering why is it necessary to rent the crane? Can't they carry the compressor up the stairs to the attic?

I dunno how true this is but was told some air con brands are disrupted by supply issues and some market players are suggesting VRV cos there's stock.

you are the buyer so you can decide what you want. if you already signed and confirmed the quotation with the supplier and they have no stock for you, then it's the supplier's fault for not reserving the stock for you and there's no reason for you to accept another more expensive aircon system especially if you need to pay extra for it. yes, supply issue may be there and I experience it myself as my supplier told me that there was no stock (whole of SG) for the ducted aircon I chose and I was offered the choice to select one from another brand (more expensive) at no extra cost to me. With COVID situation nowadays and factories could be shut, supply issue may occur. So do confirm your work schedule with your main contractor and let your aircon subcon know when you are planning to have them go in and install the aircon so that the stock for your project can be reserved first.

Why need to rent the crane? Simply because there is no way to remove the compressor from the aircon ledge through the house. The original ducted aircon compressor which I had originally planned for (based on BTU) has a dimension of 1050 x 330 x 1338 (W X D X H). The window which I had to access my aircon ledge has a max opening size of only 1000mm. So there is no way this compressor can be removed after construction is completed since it cannot go through the window. Since there is no way I'm going to tear down my window just to remove this compressor in future, the only option that makes sense is to get an aircon with a smaller compressor which can fit through the window. So it's not about humans not being able to carry the compressor from ground floor to attic but more of whether the compressor can go through the house or not. If the equipment cannot go through the house, then the only option is to get a crane to hoist it out and over the house.