CutePinkElephant 0 Report post Posted July 4, 2008 I know how you feel in the first my seller also never tell us that they will contra, and keep asking us to use their agent/his brother the reason is help us to save money no need to pay for agent fee but gv angpao can already. lucky that time i die die want to use my own agent because i feel something strange..... and yesss...agent to agent talk, their agent ask help from my agent they want to do contra. and blah blah....my agent only gv them normal procedure30days to submit. and they hv no choice and very kan cheong to find a new house.... and now im waiting to get the key,and the seller ask for early complition on 5august lerrr arghhhhhhhh my agent said some bad agent will do some bad trick on the date of submission to help the seller, like they write 30days for submission, but in the end they will put 1 infront of the 30 and become 130days for submisssion after exercise date. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JCase 0 Report post Posted July 4, 2008 Thanks JCase! Will need all the luck I can get... Hmmmn, u mention take possession of the keys... at the 2nd appt? Shouldn't they be the ones to be more worried about the extension than me?? As a buyer, like you hv mention, technically I can take over the flat at 2nd appt so they should be the ones who needs to ensure that they can extend their stay and not me getting my lawyer to do all the paper work.... and by allowing them to extend their stay, I'm liable for anything that happens in the flat? The agent was very tactless when talking to me and she should know that the seller is asking for a favour and not the other way round... I do not want things to turn ugly but seems like it's heading this way Nothing wrong with winning ugly IMO. At the end of the 2nd appt, the flat belongs to you. Sellers will now become tenents and you could technically charge them rent I believe. You could be nice and give them 1-mth grace max but to protect yourself from any further dispute, it would be worthwhile to engage a lawyer to draw up this contract. Better for you to invest some money in this rather than to miss your auspicious moving date. Some things more impt than a few hundred dollars. Ensure that they settle all utily bills etc before they move out. Effect the process to transfer SP and City Gas to your name abt 2-3 days before they have to move out. Also strange that you are paying the agent a commission You sign anything with her? Seems to me she's acting on the sellers behalf. I only used to pay agent hong bao if they are acting on sellers behalf. It's their job to get the property sold and should not charge the buyer. In fact there is no common law on this at the moment if i recall correctly. If nothing is signed then you are not liable to pay her any commission. Instead, I would pay another agent an hong bao to help expedite the 2nd appt date immediately after the 7th month. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
applefreak 1 Report post Posted July 4, 2008 well i totally don't understand what the agent's concern is about the 2nd appt if they don't want to shift during fasting month, they can shift earlier right? it's not as if there's anything against shifting BEFORE the 2nd appt stand your ground and insist that they shift out ON the 2nd appt anything that happens after 2nd appt is your responsibility can you imagine them doing something in the flat e.g. drug taking, cig smuggling you will have to go to jail for that :curse: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cyn 1 Report post Posted July 4, 2008 (edited) I know how you feel in the first my seller also never tell us that they will contra, and keep asking us to use their agent/his brother the reason is help us to save money no need to pay for agent fee but gv angpao can already. lucky that time i die die want to use my own agent because i feel something strange..... and yesss...agent to agent talk, their agent ask help from my agent they want to do contra. and blah blah....my agent only gv them normal procedure30days to submit. and they hv no choice and very kan cheong to find a new house.... and now im waiting to get the key,and the seller ask for early complition on 5august lerrr arghhhhhhhh my agent said some bad agent will do some bad trick on the date of submission to help the seller, like they write 30days for submission, but in the end they will put 1 infront of the 30 and become 130days for submisssion after exercise date. Hi CutePinkElephant! Did you agree to the early completion on 5th August? I'm sure u can reject right? At least u have ur own agent to talk to them but I'm dealing with a agent who is serving both sides .... Once the 1st apt date is firmed, it means that the submission has been done right? Hi JCase! I did sign the form agreeing to pay her 0.5% commission And I agree that she's acting more on behalf of the seller than me... Was thinking just going to sms her and tell her Choice No 1- 2nd appt on 1st Sept hand over on 21st Sept and Seller pay for the undertaking letter to be done up by my lawyer. Choice No 2- 2nd appt on 21st Aug can but handover immediate and inspection to be done before going for 2nd appointment. What do u think?? Hi Applefreak! This is all turning out to be so unpleasant but they leave me no choice The agent changes her story all the time so much that she forgets what she say! I'm going to be very firm when I talk to her from now on! No more Mrs NICE! Edited July 4, 2008 by Cyn Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CutePinkElephant 0 Report post Posted July 5, 2008 Hi Cyn, for the date they request just when on fisrt appointment infront of the officer, and we think only different 2 weeks from normal date and dont want to make them difficult. and want everything sun sun li li so just sign loh Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cyn 1 Report post Posted July 5, 2008 Hi Cyn, for the date they request just when on fisrt appointment infront of the officer, and we think only different 2 weeks from normal date and dont want to make them difficult. and want everything sun sun li li so just sign loh Hihi CutePinkElephant! I believe it's very important to buy a house happily... MaCe mention that there are a couple of good dates during the 7th mth... Maybe you can check with Mr Chong for the dates.. As for me, went to meet up Kelvin from Tau Interior Design and was grumbling to him about my incident... He too advise me to be take over on 2nd appt to avoid disputes... So I'll let HDB decide on the date now even if it's during the 7th mth and have the seller move out by then... At least he will be moving before the fasting mth and I won't be making him suffer as mention by the agent! Honestly, I respect their religion and customs but it's just the way they are using it to push me to one corner and I now have to be firm on the handing over date. Who knows if I allow them to extend, what problems will they give me during then i have lost my trust in them.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JCase 0 Report post Posted July 6, 2008 Just be firm. The seller's agent will try all sort of antics and pressure tactics. Best to amicable but sometimes if this doesn't work then you have to resort to harsher measures. By engaging a lawyer, hopefully they know that you mean business. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cyn 1 Report post Posted July 6, 2008 Just be firm. The seller's agent will try all sort of antics and pressure tactics. Best to amicable but sometimes if this doesn't work then you have to resort to harsher measures. By engaging a lawyer, hopefully they know that you mean business. Hi JCase! I'll be calling my lawyer tomorrow to see how I can go about it cos have been told that even with a letter of undertaking from them... If anything happens, the judge might not accept the undertaking letter as a legal document.... The best part is the seller's agent is also acting on behalf of us.... All along I've been very easy-going and nice and my only request is to avoid the 7th mth for my 2nd appointment and hand-over on 21st Sept... I felt very insulted when the agent mention about the fasting and say I'm out to make the seller's life miserable .. I'm already extending my goodwill by allowing an extension of 3 weeks but give them an inch, they want a mile! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JCase 0 Report post Posted July 7, 2008 Hi JCase! I'll be calling my lawyer tomorrow to see how I can go about it cos have been told that even with a letter of undertaking from them... If anything happens, the judge might not accept the undertaking letter as a legal document.... The best part is the seller's agent is also acting on behalf of us.... All along I've been very easy-going and nice and my only request is to avoid the 7th mth for my 2nd appointment and hand-over on 21st Sept... I felt very insulted when the agent mention about the fasting and say I'm out to make the seller's life miserable .. I'm already extending my goodwill by allowing an extension of 3 weeks but give them an inch, they want a mile! Being a typical scorpio, I'd tell them where to go. Seriously, the sellers agent has no prespective. In fact, the seller should already begin packing non-essential items in preparation to move out. How long to they need? When we moved out of our Sin Ming Ave pl to AMK, it took us abt 5 days to pack everything into boxes, i.e. an hour or so each day after work. Futhermore our son was only 1 yrs old at that time. Pack, label and the movers will do the rest. Wasn't all that tiring. Give them 3 weeks max, get your lawyer to advise how to make this stick. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cyn 1 Report post Posted July 7, 2008 Being a typical scorpio, I'd tell them where to go. Seriously, the sellers agent has no prespective. In fact, the seller should already begin packing non-essential items in preparation to move out. How long to they need? When we moved out of our Sin Ming Ave pl to AMK, it took us abt 5 days to pack everything into boxes, i.e. an hour or so each day after work. Futhermore our son was only 1 yrs old at that time. Pack, label and the movers will do the rest. Wasn't all that tiring. Give them 3 weeks max, get your lawyer to advise how to make this stick. Hi JCase! Agent tried calling me today but I didn't pick up in time(She used private number so didn't know it was her)... then she called my hubby and tell him that she tried contacting me but to no avail and I seem to be angry with her (which I still am)... Hubby quite smart, tell her he's busy.. anything contact me and put down the phone. I then sms her asking her to mail me the original valuation report and OTP by registered mail and I expect to receive it latest by Wednesday (Yup, until now she has not given me these documents!! ) Spoke to the lawyer today and he mentioned that in the Letter of Offer from the bank, I will need to take procession of the flat on the 2nd appointment and HDB will not allow any extension.... It will be a private arrangement between us and the seller and in case any illegal activities happen in the house, I'm liable.. And if they refuse to move out, very difficult to evict them I was thinking if I can go into a rental agreement with them for the 3 weeks?? From what I know, seller's issue is because it's a Fasting mth and he can't make up his mind on the renovation of his new place From what I know Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JCase 0 Report post Posted July 8, 2008 Hi JCase! Agent tried calling me today but I didn't pick up in time(She used private number so didn't know it was her)... then she called my hubby and tell him that she tried contacting me but to no avail and I seem to be angry with her (which I still am)... Hubby quite smart, tell her he's busy.. anything contact me and put down the phone. I then sms her asking her to mail me the original valuation report and OTP by registered mail and I expect to receive it latest by Wednesday (Yup, until now she has not given me these documents!! ) Spoke to the lawyer today and he mentioned that in the Letter of Offer from the bank, I will need to take procession of the flat on the 2nd appointment and HDB will not allow any extension.... It will be a private arrangement between us and the seller and in case any illegal activities happen in the house, I'm liable.. And if they refuse to move out, very difficult to evict them I was thinking if I can go into a rental agreement with them for the 3 weeks?? From what I know, seller's issue is because it's a Fasting mth and he can't make up his mind on the renovation of his new place From what I know Lawyer is quite right. It is a pte arrangement after the 2nd appt. You are not legally obliged to offer an extension but you choose to out of goodwill. Lawyer also needs gto advise on the aspect of rental agreement as this would be extremely short term rental. Not sure how to make this binding I'm sure your lawyer will find a way around this If rental agreement can be made to stick, then it should clearly indicate a specific date where all tenants should move out of the unit with all personal effects. Unit should be inspected for defects etc. In fact if you are kind enough to allow them to stay for 3 weeks, it's your perogative to inspect the unit, note current defects and take photo evidence. Yoo should also make an inventory of all fixures, lights aircon, ceiling fans etc as these will be your property as well. If no agreement was made in the first instance for any lights etc to be removed by consent at the first appt, then IMO it's too late. If they agree to a rental agreement, you should also collect 3-weeks refundable security deposit subject to everything being in check. There is a risk that illegal activities could/may have taken place and very hard to do anything. Make as many provisions, clauses in the agreement, maybe it would piss them off and they decide it's not worth the effort and move out straight away. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aves 0 Report post Posted July 8, 2008 (edited) eh actually.... any agreement or whatever documents also not allowed. u should be briefed of that. its the HDB rule. if HDB find out u got any other personal arrangements outside with seller. they can revoke ur buyer/seller rights. anyway as the one who 'give them free extension' u are in advantage cos u can say the agreement is invalid as per Housing and Development Act and just ask them to move out. but i don't think u want to do that... "Buyers and sellers of resale flats must use an HDB standard Option to Purchase (OTP) as the form of contract in resale transactions. They are not allowed to enter into any other agreement relating to the sale/purchase of the flat as it is not valid under the Housing and Development Act." Edited July 8, 2008 by aves Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JCase 0 Report post Posted July 8, 2008 eh actually.... any agreement or whatever documents also not allowed. u should be briefed of that. its the HDB rule. if HDB find out u got any other personal arrangements outside with seller. they can revoke ur buyer/seller rights. anyway as the one who 'give them free extension' u are in advantage cos u can say the agreement is invalid as per Housing and Development Act and just ask them to move out. but i don't think u want to do that... "Buyers and sellers of resale flats must use an HDB standard Option to Purchase (OTP) as the form of contract in resale transactions. They are not allowed to enter into any other agreement relating to the sale/purchase of the flat as it is not valid under the Housing and Development Act." Solid, that means they are at your mercy. It may seem cruel to kick them out but as aves alluded might be better to go by the book on this. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cyn 1 Report post Posted July 8, 2008 Hi JCase & Aves! She sms me and told me she has send my OTP, Valuation report and a letter to me by courier... Should get it by tomorrow... Will keep u guys updated... Last but not least... Thanks for all your advice Really appreciate it... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aves 0 Report post Posted July 9, 2008 no probs. i also in same situation. my seller ask for 6wks extension after completion. but my agent and seller all seems quite steady so far... nv chut pattern or anyhow one. i even suan the agent about the pte agreement cos she supposed to brief us through the HDB checklist for agents but she purposely skip the agreement part... then i suan her... lol my seller also quite nice. last night we went simei shopping then just pop by cos we wanna see some things condition that we cant remember like the main door and whether the room got built in wardrobe. she just let us in when she saw us and showed us the stuff. she even say that its possible they can move in early to their new flat and we could takeover before the 6wks extension ends. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
