Recommendation For A Decent Sound System.

[Marc9 0]

need some comments from all of you pls

went to Adelphi today and spent a good 4 hrs in just 2 different shops auditioning the HTS.

to be frank, we don't know what we want from our HTS. in our current lifestyle, the boyfriend and i do not watch movies at home and do not listen to music at home. not because we don't enjoy them, but because we don't stay together so don't have the time to incorporate these activities into our lifestyle.

the HTS will be in the entertainment room which is approx 4m x 4m and we need 2m x 1.6m to place a drumset, and another small area to place a digital piano. hence the sofa will prob be placed about 2.5 to 3m away from the TV.

our budget is 3k for a AVR, speakers and sub-woofer.

after 4 hours in 2 different shops, we are recommended the 2 set-ups below:

1) Denon AVR 1911 + Pro Cinema 800

2) Marantz NR-1601 AVR + Morel Soundspot SP-1 satellite speakers + Morel Soundsub PSW8 Subwoofer + Heco Victa 300 speakers

The 2nd set is more expensive than the 1st set by $540.

While auditioning the 1st set, we mixed and matched with Onkyo 508 and Wharfedale speakers.

Pardon my noob language here. We tried Onkyo + Pro Cinema 600 and felt the bass was not strong enough. So we switched to Onkyo + Pro Cinema 800 and of course it was slightly better. Then we tried Denon + Pro Cinema 800 and preferred this to Onkyo. Then we tried music instead of movie and loved the crisp sound from Denon. When we switched back to Onkyo, the music sounded very muffled. Therefore we shortlisted Denon over Onkyo.

As for the 2nd set, it seemed that for movies, it has less bass than Denon. But the surround sound seems clearer. Music from just the Heco speakers is really nice.

Now we are really confused:f

1) everyone in RT seems to favour Onkyo but we didn't like it compared to Denon. something wrong with our ears?

2) love the sounds from Heco but it doesn't seem to be popular here?

3) saw some comments here that suggests morel is overpriced? (note i didn't really care that it looked better but it was the only speakers that this shop recommended)

any comments are greatly appreciated! thanks!

Same scenario as u but budget slightly lesser than u.I tried the pro 600 and I also prefer denon..

[Ely1 0]

I just hope ELY doesn't lose sight that when all's said and done, it's not the system you're enjoying but rather the music or soundtrack. If you've made a decent choice for your own ears then hopefully the hardware disappears and you are transported by the music or film you're watching. I still love being surprised by just how real the setup I have can create an almost visual soundstage for some recordings. I'm equally certain that another bloke will think my setup is a load of codswallop I don't intend upgrading to move with the latest and greatest though I might be tempted one day with an HDMI setup if just to lose some spaghetti. My wife's a good sport about it all and enjoys the surround sound and base effects the NHTs can generate without a sub when she watches a film with me. Many of my mates don't believe I haven't got one lurking about ( a sub that is) somewhere in the basement. My older lad says he will take my amps off me as a favour if I feel the need to move with the times...nice of him eh?

I'm actually sticking with the Wharfedales, despite the expressed anti-Brit sentiment. I did like what I heard, as compared to the def tech 600, 800 and the wall mounted ones - just considering if I should change the center speaker to the 10.CS and the Velodyne sub CHQ-8 for a SVS. Not sure why, but the husband is very agitated with the purchase - major cognitive dissonance! I'm completely happy with my purchase of a mint condition second-hand Oppo 93 (the serious audiophiles have a treasure trove, especially when new models are rolling out) and the Onkyo 608.

Any recommendations for a nice sub in the same price range as the CHQ-8? I'm probably not going to be the most popular neighbour at my block.

-Ely

[mars73 0]

I'm actually sticking with the Wharfedales, despite the expressed anti-Brit sentiment. I did like what I heard, as compared to the def tech 600, 800 and the wall mounted ones - just considering if I should change the center speaker to the 10.CS and the Velodyne sub CHQ-8 for a SVS. Not sure why, but the husband is very agitated with the purchase - major cognitive dissonance! I'm completely happy with my purchase of a mint condition second-hand Oppo 93 (the serious audiophiles have a treasure trove, especially when new models are rolling out) and the Onkyo 608.

Any recommendations for a nice sub in the same price range as the CHQ-8? I'm probably not going to be the most popular neighbour at my block.

-Ely

Nice one picking up the second-hand Oppo 93. May I know where you got it from? Thinking of doing the same. Though I will probably stick with getting brand new speakers

Would also like some advice from anyone here regarding subs. Is the SVS SB10 still available? Better than the CHQ-8T?

[Ely1 0]

Nice one picking up the second-hand Oppo 93. May I know where you got it from? Thinking of doing the same. Though I will probably stick with getting brand new speakers

Would also like some advice from anyone here regarding subs. Is the SVS SB10 still available? Better than the CHQ-8T?

Got if off a guy from the AVS forum. Superb condition, like how any self-respecting audiophile will upkeep their babies. It's only 1 month old-plus, so lots of warranty in it yet, and got it for $760. He's upgrading to the 95.

Yeah, my Wharfedales (and Onkyo) are new and am so excited to putting it altogether and hearing Sting strum his lute on it.

What's everyone's personal favourite concert to watch on Blu Ray?

-Ely

[martin1023 0]

I'm actually sticking with the Wharfedales, despite the expressed anti-Brit sentiment. I did like what I heard, as compared to the def tech 600, 800 and the wall mounted ones - just considering if I should change the center speaker to the 10.CS and the Velodyne sub CHQ-8 for a SVS. Not sure why, but the husband is very agitated with the purchase - major cognitive dissonance! I'm completely happy with my purchase of a mint condition second-hand Oppo 93 (the serious audiophiles have a treasure trove, especially when new models are rolling out) and the Onkyo 608.

Any recommendations for a nice sub in the same price range as the CHQ-8? I'm probably not going to be the most popular neighbour at my block.

-Ely

May I know the reason to give up the CHQ-8? You can play around with the volume and placement to see whether it can suit you. If that fails, then you can either add another CHQ-8 to make it 2 sub or buy a > 10" sub which makes you the top 10 unpopular neighbour. I have read some website mentioning that having 2 sub can win over a single sub.

[Ely1 0]

May I know the reason to give up the CHQ-8? You can play around with the volume and placement to see whether it can suit you. If that fails, then you can either add another CHQ-8 to make it 2 sub or buy a > 10" sub which makes you the top 10 unpopular neighbour. I have read some website mentioning that having 2 sub can win over a single sub.

It isn't me really. I think I'm quite pleased with the CHQ-8T, but then again, I didn't try any other as the SVS was down and we couldn't audition that, so there's nothing I can compare it to. Just wanting to know what else is within the price bracket for us to give a try because, for some unfathomable reason, the husband is really dissatisfied with the sub. He's insisting something is "lacking" though he can't really put his finger down on what exactly.

Was told that the CHQ-10 isn't substantially different from the CHQ-8T, and that an upgrade to a SVS would cost another $5xx.

Thought I could gather some useful suggestions on other subs we should try out, even if it's simply to justify our initial purchase. Will head down to Aldephi again and endure more scenes of "Batte for Pandora" and muisical sections of System Of A Down, U2, Sting and Jamie Cullum.

-Ely

[RimBlock 0]

How is the cinema pro 600 paired with denon 1911 or onkyo?went down to adelphi and was recc the setup.WIth about 2k is there any better choices?

Ask about speaker packages around the 1K mark and see what the shops suggest. Different shops will most likely suggest different packages and some will suggest the best for their mark-up as they are a business after all. It does not mean that the set with the best mark-up is no good though. Ask for two - three recommendations and try them. Any shop that cannot provide either don't stock comparative brands or are just trying to steer you where they want.

someone suggested Q-Audio ????!!!!

i don't see this company can remain in business in even 3 years time !

and if they go bust, no one will buy the company too !

Ha-ha, guaranteed to provide some smiles.

Q-Accustics were founded in 2006 and so have been around 4-5 years already. They have won a number of awards from various international magazines (not just British). Info here. Not really hard checking out the facts rather than firing off silly sweeping statements.

for jazz and classical music, B&W 6-series are definitely a NO-NO !!!!!

So even though Mars has heard a number of setups and by far prefers the B&W 685s he should ditch his preference because they do not meet with your approval on what you believe he should be listening to. Speaks volumes really.

so you're more into movies, 1st thing 1st - never believe in all those British hifi magazines, they give good reviews base on how much they get in advertising money !

So what hifi magazines should the people here be reading then ?. So anything that got a good rating in a British hifi mag should be disregarded even if other mags also give it a good review and if user experiences are reported as being very good. Cleary that should not be the case.

So WhatHiFi gave the Onkyo 608 product of the year (Home Cinema Amps 2010), loads of people here have demo'd and loved it, it has wide acclaim around the internet as being a great av amp but should be ignored because you believe the reviews rating in a British mag was paid for by advertising. Do you not seriously see how silly that sounds ?

RB

Edited March 14, 2011 by RimBlock

[RimBlock 0]

### i know for a fact that some of the reviews were not even written by the reviewers but by the manufacturers themselves !

the editors merely edit these reviews.

Where is your proof or just slander ?. Name the magazines you 'know for a fact' are falsifying reviews.

Now we are really confused:

You started out with a confusion over what you want and what you use it for.

1) everyone in RT seems to favour Onkyo but we didn't like it compared to Denon. something wrong with our ears?

2) love the sounds from Heco but it doesn't seem to be popular here?

3) saw some comments here that suggests morel is overpriced? (note i didn't really care that it looked better but it was the only speakers that this shop recommended)

any comments are greatly appreciated! thanks!

1. Only if you think your personal taste is not as important as the taste of others. Some prefer more detail, some prefer more base, some prefer a mix of both. You prefer the Denon for its musical ability over the others. That is a fair point although if you don't really listen to music now, how likely are you to be doing so in the future. Unless you have a big interest, it is more likely that you will spend more time with watching movies but only you are in a position to decide.

2. Again, no one else matters. Try and buy what you like. You money, your pleasure. Take advice offered but do your own research as well. If you are after more choices then post asking for a system around 1-1.5k in www.avforums.com (UK site, 1-1.5k should work out to around S$3k) or a recommendation from www.avsforum.com around the 2k mark (US forums).

3. Sorry, really cannot comment. Have not tried them.

think about your surround cables now and mountings for the rear speakers.

get high-purity copper cables (get 9N copper) for the rear speakers - don't stinge on them since once they're in the false ceiling, they're staying put and it's a nightmare to change them!

Rears / side rears carry a very small amount of information. Don't go to silly lengths and pay large amounts. Buy a reasonable cable and audition it before spending the money. Most people will find it hard to notice a difference between S$2/meter and S$5/ meter cables. I still have the free S$1 speaker cable that came with an all in one system 8 years ago and it is not showing any signs of corrosion and would do fine for most people at the S$2-S$3k level. Try before you buy though as everybodys hearing is different.

I may not have false ceiling in my HTS room. Does that means that I can think of the surround cables later?

I would agree with my anti-Brit compardre that you should be working out where to put the speakers and thinking about how to mount them. You could go for bipoles (fire in two different directions) or small bookshelf speakers which you could probably mount directly on the wall or you could go for larger speakers which may need brackets. If you are starting the reno then you may want to start looking at the forums and asking for recommendations. Go wider afield than just here though .

PS: Renovation is whole lot of money....

PS: I know . Saying that I have just had my EM done for around S$43k with little custom carpentry but through an ID rather than directly with contractors. Depends on what you want really and what you are willing to pay.

I'm actually sticking with the Wharfedales, despite the expressed anti-Brit sentiment. I did like what I heard, as compared to the def tech 600, 800 and the wall mounted ones - just considering if I should change the center speaker to the 10.CS

-Ely

From what I have read the Wd 10s centre in the package is not as good as it could be. It would seem entirely valid for you to go have a listen to alternatives. Wharfedales like the 10.cs would seem to be obvious choices but you can also see what the shops can recommend as a comparison. A good shop should be able to give you alternatives.

RB

[RimBlock 0]

### a top US brand like Nordost will be able to outperform those 5-star British cables at 1/3 the price !

5 star by who ?. By your word everyone cannot trust Brit magazines for ratings. Outperform in what equipment and what environment ?. How do you believe out performance should be measured ?

### B&W 6-series are for AV - all their floorstanders boom ! Only the top 2 series in the brand is even worth listening and many brands are better at lower prices since B&W is most probably the biggest speaker advertisers.

You are aware War is talking about 685s aren't you and that the 685 set does not include floor standers ?. Like his test driving a Honda Civic and you telling him not to buy because the Honda Fit has worse suspension than other cars at the same price.

For the other more sane people here, a thread I came across in ecoustics.com asking whether B&W speakers are overrated. Interesting views and while most agree they are not, there are different opinions. My favorite post there was the third one down which includes the following (which is what I try to get over to people here)

Forget about what magazines, store owners, and people on a message board have to say. The only ears that matter are yours. Had I listened to what the majority of salesmen told me, I'd have a completely different system. I can honestly say I couldn't be happier with my system for what I paid for it. That should be the ultimate goal.

RB

[mars73 0]

I think I've been poisoned... Now I'm thinking if it is worthwhile to buy floorstanders instead of bookshelves for the front, and if budget is stretched, skip the rears for now (just lay cables). Reason being I was given a listen on the Q900 the other day and was completely hooked! The soundstage is so 3D its amazing. I remember being really impressed by the Q300 up until then... (marginally better than the 685s in my opinion, more rounded)

This got me wondering if it is worth stretching for a Q500 or Q700. The Q700 is basically the Q300 with an additional LF driver. The Q500 is similarly based on the Q100 with an additional LF driver.

One thing I have decided is to go for wall mounting my rears on the back wall (more options for speakers, especially if I need to upgrade later on). If I go KEF, I'll probably take the Q100, as it costs too much to 'break' a KHT3005 set to buy 2 satellites.

One concern is the size of my living/dining space. Its 4m across, and 6m deep. Listening position is about 3m from the front. Rear speakers will be wall mounted about 2.5m behind listening position. There will of course be corridors connecting to this space. One side of the space is completely glass (no walls). I think it is quite hard to find a similar sized space to demo speakers.

With a space like this, I wonder if a floorstander will do noticably better than book shelves for the front 2. If I get a floorstander, does that mean I get away with a smaller sub? If I get a big floorstander does that mean I get away without a sub?? I can imagine in the extreme, I just get a set of Q900, with centre Q200, no rears, no subs haha. Kelvin from KEF said that the Q500 will sound better than Q300 even though the cones are smaller, cos the duties are split between 2 different drivers in the Q500.

I'm basically going with the principle to buy the best speakers I can afford as they are likely to be around the longest (compared to HD sources and AVRs).

Sigh, this is gonna get me into trouble with the missus...

[Drexter 0]

Everyday I read this thread the more I get poisoned... hahaha.... Can't wait to lay my hands on these once my ID is confirmed.

[RimBlock 0]

With a space like this, I wonder if a floorstander will do noticably better than book shelves for the front 2. If I get a floorstander, does that mean I get away with a smaller sub? If I get a big floorstander does that mean I get away without a sub?? I can imagine in the extreme, I just get a set of Q900, with centre Q200, no rears, no subs haha. Kelvin from KEF said that the Q500 will sound better than Q300 even though the cones are smaller, cos the duties are split between 2 different drivers in the Q500.

I'm basically going with the principle to buy the best speakers I can afford as they are likely to be around the longest (compared to HD sources and AVRs).

Sigh, this is gonna get me into trouble with the missus...

Welcome to the club . We are all in trouble with our misses even/especially when doing nothing . You just have to decide to what degree....

Decent floorstanders should provide a lot more bass if sited correctly. Too close to walls and corners and you could end up with a boomy reflection. Floorstanders usually also have bass ports to help. They are unlikely to be as good as a decent sub but they can get close. Remember, subs only really became mainstream with the advent of home surround sound and were originally intended to make up for the lack of bass drivers in small wife friendly speakers. Now the appetite for having your pants shaken off when watching a movie has increased, big (controlled) bass is also a must have. I used to run a pair of Rogers LS55s which were wonderful floorstanders. If I had the chance I would probably snap them up again. They still sell well on ebay. I managed to set fire to mine (internally) due to arcing caused by a faulty amp. Blew 3 cones including scorch marks from the electricity arc and some smouldering from inside 10 minutes later. Turns out the baffle material burns quite well.....

Sounds like a good idea with the best speakers principle.

Everyday I read this thread the more I get poisoned... hahaha.... Can't wait to lay my hands on these once my ID is confirmed.

Yeah, who needs built in wardrobes when you can upgrade the speakers . Can get a bit of a dangerous game. I also do photography so have the same with cameras and lenses. Doubly wammy.

RB

[Marc9 0]

Ask about speaker packages around the 1K mark and see what the shops suggest. Different shops will most likely suggest different packages and some will suggest the best for their mark-up as they are a business after all. It does not mean that the set with the best mark-up is no good though. Ask for two - three recommendations and try them. Any shop that cannot provide either don't stock comparative brands or are just trying to steer you where they want.

Thanks for the reply..Any brand reccomendations??Gonna increase my budget to abt 2.5 and I'm thing of getting the oppo 83 or 93...ay big diff??decisions,decisions....

[RimBlock 0]

Thanks for the reply..Any brand reccomendations??Gonna increase my budget to abt 2.5 and I'm thing of getting the oppo 83 or 93...ay big diff??decisions,decisions....

np

If you want to do it properly, ask them not to tell you what they are until after you have listened. That way your preconceived ideas about the different brands will be taken out of the picture .

If you are looking at 2k on the app and speakers then you try the denon / yamaha 667 / Onkyo 608 with the Tannoy HTS 101, Q Acoustics 2000, Q Acoustics 1010is (the 2000 replaces it but you may be able to get it cheap as it is dicontiued now) or maybe the Wharfedale Diamond 10. The Monitor Audi BR2 may be worth a listen but would probably take you outside the budget.

RB

[Drexter 0]

What time do the shops in Adelphi close today? haha