1960 Intermediate Terrace - A&a, Reconstruction Or Rebuild Costs?

[leechaorui 2]

I only have 600k to build basment + 2.5storey intermediate..... Buay gao leh..... .....Pls

Depending on the details of construction, the size of the place and furnishing required, $600K is a tight but doable figure for 2/5 storey without basement.

[gong 0]

Depending on the details of construction, the size of the place and furnishing required, $600K is a tight but doable figure for 2/5 storey without basement.

Was told can only do the very basic one but exactly how "basic."... (I'm not expecting very fanciful one but at least has to be durable) Thinking of getting an engineer who can act as architecture to save cost, any good one that you guys can recommend...

[leechaorui 2]

Was told can only do the very basic one but exactly how "basic."... (I'm not expecting very fanciful one but at least has to be durable) Thinking of getting an engineer who can act as architecture to save cost, any good one that you guys can recommend...

Unless the engineer is trained in both architecture and civil engineering, they are normally two different persons. As long as you get an architect to design for you, he could outsource part of the work to an engineer. I had a neigbour who did a basic reconstruction (ie this is not the same as erection) for a 2 storey house a few years ago for a very attractive price.

He rebuild his place from single storey to 2 storey. Basic means this in his reconstruction:

1. Uses cement hollow bricks (prone to cracking after one or two years - now there are some cracks and deeper cracks will usually appear within 5 years)

2. Uses hollow red bricks (prone to hairline cracks after about 6 to 18 months - there are lots of it in his house now)

3. Build only 2 toilets (one for the upper floor and one for the ground floor)

4. No en-suite bedroom

5. Continue to use phase 1 power (ie - limited power supply eg. cannot turn on air-conditioner for all the bedrooms in one go. He uses only stand on fans)

6. Lower ceiling height (about 2.5 m after false ceiling is installed)

7. Limited number of power points, lighting points and telephone points

8. No CAT6 cabling for opennet

9. Limited number of taps

10. Homogeneous tiles (small piece type) for whole house

11. Use Indonesian Teak wood parquet for second storey as opposed to Burmese parquet

12. Use the small piece German roof tile (don't look good as opposed to using the bigger piece)

13. Water proofing is applied to toilet flooring only as opposed to whole house

14. Use weatherbond Nippon Paint (as opposed to using higher grade external paint). After about 12 to 18 months, you will see that the house paint stain badly. Some contractor will dilute the Nippon Paint and you will see the effects of staining and thiness of the paint within 6 months.

15. Use limited rebar (meet the minimum requirement) such that the house weight bearing capacity is about the same as HDB flat (cannot place a bigger size fish tank on the second floor, otherwise floor will crack).

16. Use flimsy aluminium window frame (was told that one of the window frame got blown away when there was a heavy thumderstorm during the construction phase)

17. Limit the size of window so as to save cost on windows.

18. Use inferior quality sanitaryware. Those cheap type (basin + WC) costing less than $150.

19. No autogate - use normal wrought iron gate

20. Use lousy quality DB box (only one in the house) such that when one electrical item short-circuit, the whole house will black out.

21. Full of drains in the house.

22. A lot of pillars all over the house.

23. No piling work done. Only simple footing such that it can meet URA/ BCA minimum requirements.

25. Simple carpentry work (ie. lower grade laminate, white interior, thin plywood, etc...)

26. Use of non-stainless screws

27. Use of small water pipes (ie minimum requirements by PUB) as opposed to larger pipes that can transport more water and faster

28. Don't have water pump and water tank (ie if the ground floor turn on the tap, the top floor person will have to wait or be content with little water flow)

29. Use flourocent lights instead of LED lights.

30. Don't have termite treatment when doing the footing

These are some examples of basic re-construction work on a neighbour house, but I shall not write more about it. I think the house is like a house of drains and pillars.

Although the cost is attractive, I think many homeowners expect better quality.

I have seen quite a number of house reconstruction/ erection/ A&A and everybody seem to have different views about basic construction. Some are really quite well done and they consider them as basic. Durability is also subjective in terms of time and usage. Durable for 6 mths, 1 yr, 5 yrs, 10yrs or 200 yrs? Durability is also thought of in terms of usage eg. Can you place a 3 ton item in the house without causing a crack in the floor or you can only place a maximum of 0.2 ton item?

Is the above type of reconstruction you have in mind in terms of "basic" as different people have different expectations of basic?

Edited January 31, 2011 by leechaorui

[gong 0]

Unless the engineer is trained in both architecture and civil engineering, they are normally two different persons. As long as you get an architect to design for you, he could outsource part of the work to an engineer. I had a neigbour who did a basic reconstruction (ie this is not the same as erection) for a 2 storey house a few years ago for a very attractive price.

He rebuild his place from single storey to 2 storey. Basic means this in his reconstruction:

1. Uses cement hollow bricks (prone to cracking after one or two years - now there are some cracks and deeper cracks will usually appear within 5 years)

2. Uses hollow red bricks (prone to hairline cracks after about 6 to 18 months - there are lots of it in his house now)

3. Build only 2 toilets (one for the upper floor and one for the ground floor)

4. No en-suite bedroom

5. Continue to use phase 1 power (ie - limited power supply eg. cannot turn on air-conditioner for all the bedrooms in one go. He uses only stand on fans)

6. Lower ceiling height (about 2.5 m after false ceiling is installed)

7. Limited number of power points, lighting points and telephone points

8. No CAT6 cabling for opennet

9. Limited number of taps

10. Homogeneous tiles (small piece type) for whole house

11. Use Indonesian Teak wood parquet for second storey as opposed to Burmese parquet

12. Use the small piece German roof tile (don't look good as opposed to using the bigger piece)

13. Water proofing is applied to toilet flooring only as opposed to whole house

14. Use weatherbond Nippon Paint (as opposed to using higher grade external paint). After about 12 to 18 months, you will see that the house paint stain badly. Some contractor will dilute the Nippon Paint and you will see the effects of staining and thiness of the paint within 6 months.

15. Use limited rebar (meet the minimum requirement) such that the house weight bearing capacity is about the same as HDB flat (cannot place a bigger size fish tank on the second floor, otherwise floor will crack).

16. Use flimsy aluminium window frame (was told that one of the window frame got blown away when there was a heavy thumderstorm during the construction phase)

17. Limit the size of window so as to save cost on windows.

18. Use inferior quality sanitaryware. Those cheap type (basin + WC) costing less than $150.

19. No autogate - use normal wrought iron gate

20. Use lousy quality DB box (only one in the house) such that when one electrical item short-circuit, the whole house will black out.

21. Full of drains in the house.

22. A lot of pillars all over the house.

23. No piling work done. Only simple footing such that it can meet URA/ BCA minimum requirements.

25. Simple carpentry work (ie. lower grade laminate, white interior, thin plywood, etc...)

26. Use of non-stainless screws

27. Use of small water pipes (ie minimum requirements by PUB) as opposed to larger pipes that can transport more water and faster

28. Don't have water pump and water tank (ie if the ground floor turn on the tap, the top floor person will have to wait or be content with little water flow)

29. Use flourocent lights instead of LED lights.

30. Don't have termite treatment when doing the footing

These are some examples of basic re-construction work on a neighbour house, but I shall not write more about it. I think the house is like a house of drains and pillars.

Although the cost is attractive, I think many homeowners expect better quality.

I have seen quite a number of house reconstruction/ erection/ A&A and everybody seem to have different views about basic construction. Some are really quite well done and they consider them as basic. Durability is also subjective in terms of time and usage. Durable for 6 mths, 1 yr, 5 yrs, 10yrs or 200 yrs? Durability is also thought of in terms of usage eg. Can you place a 3 ton item in the house without causing a crack in the floor or you can only place a maximum of 0.2 ton item?

Is the above type of reconstruction you have in mind in terms of "basic" as different people have different expectations of basic?

Hi LeeChaoRui,

Thanks for your detailed reply. May I ask what in your opinion, is the minimum budget for a recon of a 2.5 storey plus a basement intermediate terrace, taking into account that the ground level is already lower to accomodate for the basement level, which has also been done by the neighbour next door.

Thanks,

gong

[leechaorui 2]

Hi LeeChaoRui,

Thanks for your detailed reply. May I ask what in your opinion, is the minimum budget for a recon of a 2.5 storey plus a basement intermediate terrace, taking into account that the ground level is already lower to accomodate for the basement level, which has also been done by the neighbour next door.

Thanks,

gong

Hi Gong,

Basement construction typically cost more than putting up another level. The cost of constructing the basement is dependent on a few factors such as whether there is any sewage pipe from your neighbours' house that run across to your house, the size of the basement, the depth of your basement and other technical specifications. I don't think it make much difference in terms of cost when constructing a basement on a ground that is slightly lower than your neighbour's house.

My estimate of an additional basement construction alone can cost an additional between $120K to $250K for about 1000 sq ft of space.

The total cost excluding furnishing for constructing a decently build 2.5 storey house without basement that yield about 3000 + sq ft of built up space can range from anything like $600K to $700K. If you add basement, the cost estimates could be in the region of $720K to $950K. In constructing a new house, I don't believe in going for complete basic. Certain things you can save and there are certain items that one should not cut from the wish list.

Examples of items that can be save are:

1. Use Indonesian Teak Parquet instead of Burmese Teak Parquet or bamboo flooring

2. Use of lesser windows (to reduce heat in the house, one can reduce the size of windows esp if your house is a corner terrace/ semi detached)

3. Point 3 is related to point 2 - the reduced window size also mean that one will use less curtain materials.

4. Use a turnkey builder instead of engaging an architect separately to manage the project.

If you have further questions, you can pm me your hp and we can chat. I have just constructed my place and my memory is still fresh on what I have done and what are the things I feel are mistakes in construction.

[kelsiah 0]

Hi LeeChaoRui,

Thanks for your detailed reply. May I ask what in your opinion, is the minimum budget for a recon of a 2.5 storey plus a basement intermediate terrace, taking into account that the ground level is already lower to accomodate for the basement level, which has also been done by the neighbour next door.

Thanks,

gong

We are in the process of building a 2.5storey + basement. We wanted a basement to take advantage of the profile of the land, ie, we have a slope @ the back of land. It is a 1/2 open basement which allows us to locate the CD shelter, maid's room and work area (ironing, dry clothes etc). It's not a big basement, probably about 500sqft or so

When I started looking around early 2010, incremental cost for basement was around 70K to 100K, depending on whether you need piling. We were lucky. Soil is good. So no need to micropile. Seems like costs have gone up.

The other thing you need to be aware is how deep is your sewer pipe. Mine is 1.2 below ground level. So I can't have a toilet at the basement as it will be lower than the sewer pipe. The solution is to install a sewer pump which will cost another 20K. In addition to that, you need maintenance. Imagine the sluge. So We opted for a dry basement. As ours is an open basement, it is exposed to rain. Luckily to don't have to install sump pit (this is the water pump for rain water only) which will costs another 8k or so.

I approached it from design and build. My contractor is not the mega type like Richbuilt, Facade etc. But I get direct access. He is fairly responsive and techincally good, which means don't expect arty farty architectural design.

Based on developer standard (ie, getting to TOP w/o internal carpentry for wardrobe, $6psf for marble and $3psf for homogenous tile), I'm paying approx close to $800K for 4500psf, excluding GST. Since then, he's been giving me sound bites that cement and steel has increased by over 20%.

Along the way, we got a bit vain and improve some of the finishes (for eg. increasing height of sliding window from standard 2.8m to 3.3m) which means the costs is going up.

[kardtoon 0]

Hi LeeChaoRui,

Thanks for your detailed reply. May I ask what in your opinion, is the minimum budget for a recon of a 2.5 storey plus a basement intermediate terrace, taking into account that the ground level is already lower to accomodate for the basement level, which has also been done by the neighbour next door.

Thanks,

gong

I've heard from builders and architect that garment for inter terrace is more expensive than corners, semi-D or detached at the same size. This is because for inters, you need protection works for both your left and right neighbors.

Have you spoken to architects or builders? What did they say about viability of your budget?

[gong 0]

I've heard from builders and architect that garment for inter terrace is more expensive than corners, semi-D or detached at the same size. This is because for inters, you need protection works for both your left and right neighbors.

Have you spoken to architects or builders? What did they say about viability of your budget?

Hi Kardtoon,

Briefly talked to one architect on the phone and he said with a budget of 600k is tight but possible... Intend to seriously search for one next week but need more advice online before shortlisting some.. Any good architect or builder u could recommend?

Thanks n have a splendid Chinese New Year

[ngtg1 0]

Hi Kardtoon,

Briefly talked to one architect on the phone and he said with a budget of 600k is tight but possible... Intend to seriously search for one next week but need more advice online before shortlisting some.. Any good architect or builder u could recommend?

Thanks n have a splendid Chinese New Year

Do remember to factor gst in overall cost. It is a hefty amount and not many contractors can absorb it. When they quote you a budget cost typically they left out the gst to make it attractive.

[yoongf 11]

Based on developer standard (ie, getting to TOP w/o internal carpentry for wardrobe, $6psf for marble and $3psf for homogenous tile), I'm paying approx close to $800K for 4500psf, excluding GST.

Getting from TOP level of finishing to move-in condition, can easily add another 100K due to sheer size of landed.

There are tons of lighting/ceiling fans, both interior and exterior to factor in. Also, the carpentry works are substantial, if want wet kitchen/ gardening sheds/ driveway carbinets. If the original building contract did not include false ceiling, then this cost will also have to be factored in.

I think this is one area, many ppl did not factor in, when considering landed.

[leechaorui 2]

We are in the process of building a 2.5storey + basement. We wanted a basement to take advantage of the profile of the land, ie, we have a slope @ the back of land. It is a 1/2 open basement which allows us to locate the CD shelter, maid's room and work area (ironing, dry clothes etc). It's not a big basement, probably about 500sqft or so

When I started looking around early 2010, incremental cost for basement was around 70K to 100K, depending on whether you need piling. We were lucky. Soil is good. So no need to micropile. Seems like costs have gone up.

The other thing you need to be aware is how deep is your sewer pipe. Mine is 1.2 below ground level. So I can't have a toilet at the basement as it will be lower than the sewer pipe. The solution is to install a sewer pump which will cost another 20K. In addition to that, you need maintenance. Imagine the sluge. So We opted for a dry basement. As ours is an open basement, it is exposed to rain. Luckily to don't have to install sump pit (this is the water pump for rain water only) which will costs another 8k or so.

I approached it from design and build. My contractor is not the mega type like Richbuilt, Facade etc. But I get direct access. He is fairly responsive and techincally good, which means don't expect arty farty architectural design.

Based on developer standard (ie, getting to TOP w/o internal carpentry for wardrobe, $6psf for marble and $3psf for homogenous tile), I'm paying approx close to $800K for 4500psf, excluding GST. Since then, he's been giving me sound bites that cement and steel has increased by over 20%.

Along the way, we got a bit vain and improve some of the finishes (for eg. increasing height of sliding window from standard 2.8m to 3.3m) which means the costs is going up.

Hi Kelvin,

Cong Xi Fa Cai, Happy CNY.

I think the price you are paying to rebuild your house is competitive. What is the ceiling height for your basement? I was quoted $120K for the construction of a basement with 1000 sqft space, 2 toilets with bath, a device to suck out warm air, air-conditioner and I would be able to put the home shelter at the basement area. Decided against it. Now, I think the cost to construct a similar basement would be higher.

Your price of $800K excluding 7% GST to construct 4,500 sqft of built up is fairly competitive. How do your contractor compute the built up space? Is it all areas including your balcony, bay window, planter box, RC ledge, car pouch, etc...? Increasingly, I noticed that my neighbours who are beginning to construct their houses tend to pay prices in the range of $700K upwards even for intermediate terrace with land size of less than 2000 sqft.

I think it is a bit tight to budget $6 psf for marble and $3 psf for homogeneous tiles. I didn't use marble for my house construction. For homogeneous tiles, I paid about $5 psf inclusive of GST and some of the more designer type of homogeneous tiles cost me $15 psf. In addition, I used some feature wall stone for the exterior and granite for interior. Can't remember the exact price I paid, I think feature wall tile is about $28 psf and a slab of black galaxy granite is about $1000. I used about 7 slabs of black galaxy granite for vanity top in toilets, kitchen top and bar top counter. I think the granite I used for my flooring is cheaper, cost around $10 psf. I believe good quality fine marble cut from bigger slabs of marble cost much more than granite. Unless you have special lobang to get the tiles cheaply, you may want to budget extra for the purchase of tiles.

Yoongf is right, you may want to budget an extra $100K for the furnishing. Carpentry works, Chengai wood features in some places, some furniture such as sofa, dining table etc.., sanitaryware, lighting, fans, air-conditioner (if this is not included), CAT6 terminals in every room and living area, extra power points so that you have more flexibility, electrical appliances, LED lighting (optional but good to have), landscaping, etc... I believe false ceiling should be included in your contract.

[RamRam 0]

I don't think that there is any rules in reconstruction to stop you from shifting your staircase. You can send URA an email to enquire to be doubly sure.

Hi,

I am in the midst of reconstruction and have got approval from BCA to shift my staircase. So confirmed no issue with the authorities.

I have been out of the forum for a while but now I am back. I am doing reconstruction and it includes everything except the carpentary in the house. I am looking higha and low for carpentary people. This is for the kitchen, wardrobe, toilets, walk in closet, etc.

Can pm me if there is good recommendation.

Cheers and best of luck

[kardtoon 0]

Hi,

I am in the midst of reconstruction and have got approval from BCA to shift my staircase. So confirmed no issue with the authorities.

I have been out of the forum for a while but now I am back. I am doing reconstruction and it includes everything except the carpentary in the house. I am looking higha and low for carpentary people. This is for the kitchen, wardrobe, toilets, walk in closet, etc.

Can pm me if there is good recommendation.

Cheers and best of luck

Curious why you wouldn't ask your builder to include carpentry? cost no good? workmanship no good?

[yapyap 0]

Hi, we are currently doing a reconstruction of our dream house at the moment, land of 1800sqft and future buildup will be 3200sqft. Our total cost for the reconstruction is slightly more than 300k, thanks very much to our builder, he is a small time builder but very experience. Also we managed to keep cost down by sourcing for our marbles and sanitary wears at warehouse sale. Can u imagine getting italy marbles at $3psf? That 300k included PE and architect costs, and all necessary permits and approvals. We can intro our builder and architect to u if u are interested, but u have to know what u want. Cheers

wow.. the price you have is really quite low.. im quite surprise you can get such rate .. it's less than 100psf??

[yapyap 0]

btw, i am looking at doing some minor extension A&A work.. looking to convert my current back balcony area (about 20sqm) into a room and add a 3rd storey.. so total GFA increment is 40sqm.

1 PE quoted me 9k for just submission, plan, drawing excluding foreman and govt submission cost which could add another 5k.

i dont think it's competitive for a area this size..

anyone has engineer to recommend at a more reasonable cost?